Showing posts with label jill stein. Show all posts
Showing posts with label jill stein. Show all posts

Wednesday, January 1, 2020

Centrist ideologues ready to bombard the progressive Democratic candidates

Jonathan Chait seems to be carved out a 2020 niche for himself as a reliable bellwether of corporate centrism. His piece Tulsi Gabbard and the Return of the Anti-Anti-Trump Left (New York 12/23/2019) is a good example:
Left-wing anti-anti-Trumpism played an important role in the bizarre 2016 outcome. Die-hard Bernie activists, fired up with anger at the release of DNC emails stolen by Russians that purportedly showed the party had rigged the primary, demonstrated against the party outside its convention hall and tried to drown out the speakers inside with boos. Stein attacked Hillary Clinton from the left, then audaciously staged a grift-y fundraising scheme supposedly to hold recounts in the states she had labored to flip to Trump. Trump’s election appeared to deliver the same shock of reality that had vaporized Ralph Nader’s 2000 support.

But Gabbard’s emergence is another indication that the disaffection that drove these events has not disappeared. Anti-anti-Trumpism has maintained a small but durable intellectual infrastructure. The sentiments that first registered as dissent from the Russia investigation transferred to impeachment, and a chorus of left-wing voices is attacking the effort to remove Trump from office as at best a misguided diversion and at worst a deep-state coup.
This is mainly a tacky attempt to stigmatize any Democrat to the left of Biden or Buttigieg as not very desirable people to be associated with. This year is going to be filled with many flights of fancy and propaganda like that one. Trying to refute columns like this point by point would be mainly a waste of time, because their persuasiveness is how well they resonate within Democratic faction fights and the chronically lazy habits of the corporate press.

But keeping a grip on reality is also a good thing.

Tulsi Gabbard has always been hard to place. She endorsed Sanders in 2016 and for the next several years tried to portray herself as a progressive in the Sanders-Warren "lane". In the course of 2019, she moved far enough to the right that she voted "present" on Trump's impeachment. But she's always been disturbingly well-disposed toward Hindu nationalism and has supported the kind of Islamophobia connected with it and with a lot of far-right politics generally. She has always taken a simplistically hawkish position on the War on Terror. That "present" vote along with not contesting her Congressional seat may be signs she's setting up for some kind of third party gig.

I know that Chait's handwringing about third parties is part of a narrative that is deeply embedded in Democratic Party rhetoric. It's not entirely wrong. For instance, if Joe Biden has a majority at the Democratic convention but then has all his delegates instead vote to draft Mitt Romney as the Democratic Presidential candidate, the handful of Republican NeverTrumpers will be having verbal orgasms about it for the rest of their lives. But that would produce a big third party candidacy with candidates able to pull enough votes to have a real shot at the White House. So it's possible.

The point, of course, is not that Biden will actually do exactly that. But he did say he might consider a hypothetical Republican as his Vice Presidential running mate. Ticket-balancing used to me picking a politician from one's own party as the VP candidate who would bring additional strength geographically or from a competing party faction. Ticket-balancing by picking a member of the opposing party as the VP nominee would be a new approach!

So Biden and the corporate Dems should have to worry about how reckless acts of pathological centrism might drives voters away from the Democratic Party.

There will always be some minor third party entries, and some tiny percentage of the vote will go to one or two of them. In practice, it's almost impossible to measure the effect of most of those, because a large portion of the tiny number who vote third party are none-of-the-above voters. Who they might have voted for otherwise basically has to be estimated from exit polling. In 2016, it's by no means clear how the absence of the candidacies of Jill Stein and Gary Johnson would have affected the Presidential election outcome in Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania. (But please don't anyone tell Neera Tanden; the poor woman might have a stroke.)

It's been hard for Americans to walk and talk at the same time when it comes to Russia since well before the First World War. So that's nothing new. But there are a group of people who think of themselves as left who desperately want to believe that somehow Trump is pursuing a peace policy toward Russia, when he's actually just stumbling alone from one dirty deal to another. But Trump's total indifference to nuclear proliferation - except when he's using it as an excuse to threaten war with Iran - is the opposite of a peace policy.

Chait uses Glenn Greenwald as an example of a sinister leftie. Greenwald usually comes down on the left side of the issues with which he publicly engages. And in Brazil, where he lives, he's been very much an advocate for the center-left leader Lula de Silva, and good on him for that. But Greenwald has always been kind of a doctrinaire libertarian, so he opposes campaign finance spending limitations, for instance. Dave Neiwert has been pointing out his occassionally disturbing libertarian position for years. This recent post of his sums up some of it. Michael Moore on Trump, 2020 & Why “the Old, Angry White Guy” Doesn’t Represent the Working Class 12/30/2019:


Michael Moore was on Democracy Now! the other day and said that in Michigan in 2016, there were districts that went heavily for Democrats in which 90 thousand ballots were cast with no vote for President. I've never dug into those partiular results, and it might be hard to make a reasonable guess of the impact of those, either. But it's a way bigger number than what Jill Stein pulled in Michigan.

Wednesday, October 23, 2019

Again on the Hillary Clinton/Tulsi Gabbard controversy

Since I mentioned the current Hillary Clinton/Tulsi Gabbart flap in a long previous post, I'm going to follow up with a couple of links and some comments.

The Clinton statements in question came in an October 17 interview with David Plouffe on his podcast, Campaign HQ. The interview is around 45 minutes, and an interesting and informative one. Hillary is smart and has an incredible amount of experience in politics and law.

The Tulsi Gabbart moment comes in the second half. PolitiFact has provided a partial transcript that includes the Gabbart part. (Miriam Valverde, In Context: Hillary Clinton on Tulsi Gabbard, the Trump campaign and Russia 10/22/2019) This is from the transcript, talking about the 2020 general election and assuming that Trump will be the Republican candidate:
Clinton: "Well, I think there's going to be two parts and I think it's going to be the same as 2016: ‘Don't vote for the other guy. You don't like me? Don't vote for the other guy because the other guy is going to do X, Y and Z or the other guy did such terrible things and I'm going to show you in these, you know, flashing videos that appear and then disappear and they're on the dark web, and nobody can find them, but you're going to see them and you're going to see that person doing these horrible things.’"

"They're also going to do third party again. And I'm not making any predictions but I think they've got their eye on somebody who is currently in the Democratic primary and are grooming her to be the third party candidate. She's the favorite of the Russians. They have a bunch of sites and bots and other ways of supporting her so far, and that's assuming Jill Stein will give it up. Which she might not, 'cause she's also a Russian asset."

Plouffe: (Inaudible)

Clinton: "Yeah, she's a Russian asset, I mean, totally.

"And so, they know they can't win without a third party candidate and, so, I don't know who it's going to be it but I will guarantee you they'll have a vigorous third party challenge in the key states that they most need it."
The part that PolitiFact quotes begins in the podcast at around 33:00 minutes.

After listening to the whole podcast, my judgment is still that Clinton was strongly implying that Tulsi Gabbard is being groomed by Russia to be a spoiler third party candidate. She doesn't use Gabbard's name, but I've yet to see anyone suggest she was talking about Elizabeth Warren, Kamala Harris, or Amy Klobuchar. Even in the quote included above, it also sounds like she's implying that Gabbard is a "Russian asset" like she specifically accuses Jill Stein of being.

Anyone can misspeak. But Hillary Clinton is not exactly new to giving media interviews. And as the rest of the interview shows, she's able to deliver her points articulately and convincingly. Earlier in the interview at around 22:00, she talks about Trump's campaign and Russian interference and how she expects it to happen again in 2020. After the interview is over, Plouffe also assumed that she was talking about Tulsi Gabbard in that section quoted above.

So that's my reading of what she was saying about Tulsi Gabbard without naming her explicitly. And I won't recap here what I said about why that's problematic in my earlier post.

But I would also encourage people to listen to the postcast. For one thing, it's an illustration of how impressive Hillary Clinton comes across in this format, as opposed to her stump speech style. And she's providing some well-informed political analysis here. She comes across very strongly on her criticism of voter suppression.

But I will add that, unlike what she presents in this podcast, I haven't seen the evidence from the post-election voting and polling analyses that the third party voting in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania was decisive to the 2016 Electoral College outcome.

Sunday, September 1, 2019

That whole Jill Stein thing in 2016 again …

Ruy Teixeira has written a useful short article on the perennially important theological question of whether Green Party candidate Jill Stein cost Hillary Clinton the Presidential election in 2016: Did Third Parties Sink Hillary Clinton in 2016? American Prospect 08/29/2019.

He deals with the effect of third-party Presidential candidates more generally, which include Gary Johnson (Libertarian Party) and Evan McMullin (Independent), not only Jill Stein.

Teixeira refers to a study, whose conclusions he summarizes this way:
Trump still wins the electoral vote [in an estimate without the two small parties], only by a larger margin, 309–229. This is because he still carries the key states of Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin, while also carrying New Hampshire by a narrow margin. This makes sense when one considers the actual distribution of the third-party vote in these states: Michigan, Johnson 3.6 percent/Stein 1.1 percent; New Hampshire, Johnson 4.9/Stein .9; Pennsylvania, Johnson 2.4/Stein .8; Wisconsin, Johnson 3.6/Stein 1.
So the third-party effect is not necessarily anti-Democratic. And Hillary Clinton did not lose the 2016 election because of it.

Yes, that sound you hear is the anguished screaming of corporate Democrats for whom Jill Stein will forever be a Putin stooge who put Trump in the White House by denying her the Electoral College votes of Michigan, Pennsylvania, and Wisconsin.

From the figures quoted above - Michigan, Johnson 3.6%, Stein; Pennsylvania J 2.4%, S 1.1%; Wisconsin J 3.6%, S 1.1%:

  • If Johnson had not been in the race, and
  • If Stein had still been in the race, and
  • If all Johnson's voters had still voted, and
  • If all of them had gone to Clinton,
  • Then Clinton might have won.

Also:

  • If neither Stein nor Johnson had been in the race, and
  • If all Stein’s and Johnson’s voters had still voted, and
  • If more than half of the Stein and Johnson voters had gone to Clinton,
  • Then Maybe Clinton would have won.

I didn’t crunch the numbers any more exactly. But Teixeira’s figures put the Jill Stein question in the right context.

While Libertarian voters are closer to Republicans positions and Greens closer to the Democrats’, it would be wrong to simply assume that all the Libertarian voters would have gone to Trump and the Greens to Clinton.

But third party voters wouldn’t all have gone to their supposedly corresponding major party. Some of them wouldn’t have voted, or just wrote some candidate in. If either Stein or Johnson had not been there and the other was, some Johnson voters would have gone to Stein and vice versa. It’s likely that some Stein voters were confused enough to have voted for Trump. The Johnson voters would have probably gone more for Trump than Clinton, which is why Johnson’s absence from the race wouldn’t necessarily have put Clinton over the top.

The study to which Teixeira referred is now entirely new. Its publication date is April 2008, America’s Electoral Future Demographic Shifts and the Future of the Trump Coalition, authored by Teixeira, Robert Griffin and William Frey.

That’s not to say that neither the Republicans nor the Democrats will attempt to play strategic games to use third parties against the other side. Politics is politics. But evidence-based analysis of politics is generally preferable to the alternatives.

Das ganze Jill Stein Ding im Jahr 2016 wieder ...

Ruy Teixeira hat einen nützlichen kurzen Artikel über die immer wichtigere theologische Frage geschrieben, ob die Kandidatin der Grünen, Jill Stein, Hillary Clinton die amerikanische Präsidentschaftswahl 2016 gekostet hat:Did Third Parties Sink Hillary Clinton in 2016? American Prospect 29.08.2019

Er beschäftigt sich mit der Wirkung von Drittkandidaten im Allgemeinen Präsidentschaftswahl, zu denen Gary Johnson (Libertarian Party) und Evan McMullin (Unabhängig) gehören, nicht nur Jill Stein.

Teixeira bezieht sich auf eine Studie, deren Schlussfolgerungen er so zusammenfasst:
[in einer Schätzung ohne die beiden kleinen Parteien] gewinnt Trump die Wahl immer noch, nur mit einem größeren Vorsprung, 309-229. Das liegt daran, dass er immer noch die Schlüsselstaaten Michigan, Pennsylvania und Wisconsin trägt, während er auch New Hampshire mit einem knappen Vorsprung trägt. Das macht Sinn, wenn man die tatsächliche Verteilung der Dritt-Parteien-Stimmen in diesen Staaten betrachtet: Michigan, Johnson 3,6 Prozent/Stein 1,1 Prozent; New Hampshire, Johnson 4.9/Stein .9; Pennsylvania, Johnson 2.4/Stein .8; Wisconsin, Johnson 3.6/Stein 1.
Der Effekt Dritter Parteien hat also nicht unbedingt die Demokratische Partei geschadet. Und Hillary Clinton hat die Wahl 2016 dadurch nicht verloren.

Ja, dieser Ton, den Sie hören, ist das ängstliche Schreien der Demokraten, für die Jill Stein für immer ein Putin-Stooge sein wird, der Trump ins Weiße Haus brachte, indem er ihr die Stimmen des Electoral College von Michigan, Pennsylvania und Wisconsin verweigerte. Aus den oben genannten Zahlen - Michigan, Johnson 3,6%, Stein; Pennsylvania J 2,4%, S 1,1%; Wisconsin J 3,6%, S 1,1%:

  • Wäre Johnson nicht im Rennen gewesen, und
  • Wenn Stein noch im Rennen gewesen wäre, und
  • Hätten alle Steins Wähler noch abgestimmt, und
  • Wenn sie alle zu Clinton gegangen wären, dann Clinton hätte gewinnen können.
Auch:
  • Wenn weder Stein noch Johnson im Rennen gewesen wären, und
  • Wenn alle Wähler von Stein und Johnson noch abgestimmt hätten und
  • Wenn mehr als die Hälfte der Stein- und Johnson-Wähler zu Clinton gegangen wäre,
  • Dann Vielleicht hätte Clinton gewonnen.
Ich habe die Zahlen nicht genauer geknackt. Doch Teixeiras Zahlen stellen die Jill-Stein-Frage in den richtigen Kontext.

Obwohl die libertären Wähler den Positionen der Republikaner und den Grünen näher an den Demokraten sind, wäre es falsch, einfach davon auszugehen, dass alle libertären Wähler zu Trump und die Grünen zu Clinton gegangen wären.

Aber dritt-parteiliche Wähler wären nicht alle zu ihrer angeblich entsprechenden großen Partei gegangen. Einige von ihnen hätten nicht abgestimmt oder einfach nur einen Kandidaten hineingeschrieben. Wenn Stein oder Johnson nicht da gewesen wären und der andere war es, wären einige Johnson-Wähler zu Stein gegangen und umgekehrt. Es ist wahrscheinlich, dass einige Stein-Wähler so verwirrt waren, dass sie für Trump gestimmt hätten. Die Johnson-Wähler wären wahrscheinlich mehr zu Trump gegangen als Clinton, weshalb Johnsons Abwesenheit aus dem Rennen Clinton nicht unbedingt an die Spitze gebracht hätte.

Die Studie, auf die Teixeira Bezug genommen hat, ist nicht völlig neu. Das Veröffentlichungsdatum ist April 2008, America es Electoral Future Demographic Shifts and the Future of the Trump Coalition, verfasst von Teixeira, Robert Griffin und William Frey.

Das soll nicht heißen, dass weder die Republikaner noch die Demokraten versuchen werden, strategische Spiele zu spielen, um eine dritte Partei gegen die andere Seite einzusetzen. Politik ist Politik. Aber eine evidenzbasierte Analyse der Politik ist im Allgemeinen den Alternativen vorzuziehen.